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General Category => General Scroll Saw Talk => Topic started by: Intarsia92 on May 21, 2010, 09:46:06 pm
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Of the 1024 members of this SSW Community how many have an interest in Intarsias?
Al
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Count me in! I do segmentation (does that count as Intarsia) but also want to do Intarsia.
Sheila :)
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Me too, Love to learn... Just don't know if I have the patience...
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I have done many Intarsia pieces. For me it does not take any more patience than fretwork or portraits
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I have a Screaming Eagle pattern that I got from Wildwood Designs. I've been putting it off, [trying to gather the wood I need]. I love to get started on it this summer sometime. Dave. 8)
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I have at least a potential interest but not much knowledge. I spent a while on youtube the other night to see if I could find anybody doing intarsia videos but didn't have much luck. Reading about it is one thing but a video would be great for understanding what all is involved.
Are you asking because you are thinking of offering instruction or making some videos? Because I would love to at least give it a try. :)
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I primarily do intarsia, but occasionally will do some fretwork. If you even have a slight interest in intarsia, please ask your questions and someone will answer them. Be heading back to TN for another class with JGR in two weeks. If we can't answer it here, I will ask her and post a solution.
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Becky - go up to the JGR site (www.intarsia.com) and download the free whale pattern. There are 8 pages of instructions with it. It only has 7 pieces. Start with some softwood, depending where you live will sort of determine what you can get, but maybe some red cedar. It is easy to cut, and has lots of color variation. You will need at least 3 copies of the pattern so you can separate all the pattern parts before you fasten the pattern to the wood. Just for variation, use a darker wood for the top of the whale and a lighter wood for the underside. Students really like that.
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That's a great idea. I went to the site and downloaded the instructions and copies of the whale. I will give it a try as the instructions seem quite comprehensive and easy to follow. I too would like to get to Tn and take a beginner class and make a duck decoy. But, first I will give this a try and if it works out it could be a new area of fun.
Thanks again for the info.
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Count me in!!! I am interested!!!
Tonya
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me to tried it would love to learn it
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Newtoscroll, JGR, www.intarsia.com has a couple of "Duck" patterns you may want to try: #I85 is a "Pup With Decoy" that you could easily leave off the Lab Pup if you just wanted the Decoy Portion; It is a Beginner/Intermediate Pattern and #I24 is a "Duck" Pattern which is a Intermediate Pattern.
Al
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Count me in also. I have been putting it of, but would love to learn more about it. The more intarsia I see the more I would like to try it. My problem is getting different wood. But maybe I can just stain the different pieces in different colours.
David
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I am very interested in intarsia. I do segmentation but would like to move to intarsia.
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i am diying to to get started in intarsia just keeps geting put off
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I'll put the whale on my to-do list. My to-do list is going to keep me busy for a long time!
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I am also interested in Intarsia. I wish I could get more time in the shed!
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I am very interested, and have started on soem of the designs by KAthy Wise in her book "Intarsia Woodworking For Beginners". Some one suggested doing a hands on video showing technic,etc. I also have an interest in carving and have been watching a series of videos on Youtube. Seeing it being done is for me always easier to understand.
Pieter
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very keen to learn. have had a go and found it very dificult.
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I am always saying that I want to do Intarsia but always have too many others things I want to get done first. Maybe one day.........
Marg
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I moved up on the whale because it got my curiousity going. Ouch. I went very slow and really concentrated on staying on the lines but I don't think my skill level is quite up to intarsia yet. I haven't even been scrolling for 6 months yet. I'm getting a lot better on staying on the lines but I am clearly not as good as I need to be yet.
I am thinking though that maybe I could do some segmentation while I practice and improve my aim. Being made out of a single piece of wood, it's a lot more forgiving. I did a web search but I am not finding a good source for segmentation patterns. Can someone recommend one or more?
Apologies if this amounts to a hijacking of the original thread but it was the original thread that even got me thinking this way!
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Hi Becky
This is a good thread to answer your questions about either process. There is a good book with patterns for segmentation. It is "Scroll Saw Segmentation - Patterns, Projects, & Techniques" by Patrick Speilman. It was from Sterling Publishing Co., New York - A Sterling/Chapelle Book. It was copyright 2000. email Chapelle@ChapelleLtd.com. www.chapelleltd.com/library/
They still have the book listed. Good Luck.
Maybe someone else can chime in with more information for you. Cheers. Dan
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One thing that can be emphasized a little and it was taught by Jerry Booher at the JRG classes is that when you first take your pattern and cut out the paper pieces, take a highlighter and mark along the edge of the pattern pieces where it does not contact other wood pieces. So for the whale, you would highlight from the nose to the top fin and the outside of the fin plus the back of the tail up to where it joins the body and then along the belly up to the side fin and then some in front of the fin to the mouth. The reason you do this, is that you don't have to be quite so critical to stay on the line. You can sand out any blemishes afterwards. The lines you did not mark are critical so you must concentrate a little more to get accurate cuts so your pieces fit. Cheers.
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:) Long ago, I was only marquetry, now I no longer do that from time to time when they ask.
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Becky, if you want do some "cutsey" segmentation you could try looking in kids coloring books, you can find some really nice patterns that look great when cut and painted, i've done quite a few in the past, some very easy and some quite detailed, it's worth a look!
Ian
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some day i'll get time enough to try intarsia...segmentation is loads faster though....
i just recently did a segmentation...got the pattern from a site with free stained glass patterns...do a search on 'free stained glass patterns'...loads available and they're great for segmentation!
this was my 2nd attempt at a segmentation...the picture is approx. 8x10 and was cut from 1/4" thick poplar.
i cut it all apart, ran my dremel w/ sanding attachment over the edges, painted with milkpaint and then glued it down on a piece of foamcore...sprayed w/ 'clear'.
this is a picture after i finished painting it, before gluing it together....
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v156/ljfrompa/woodworking/DSCF1659a.jpg)
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Of all the different scroll saw techniques there are Intarsia is #1 for me ,i would not have it any other way.
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Thanks for all the suggestions. I have ordered that book. I went through a bunch of coloring book pages via yahoo and google image searches but didn't really find anything that lit my fire. I'd have never thought of stained glass in a million years but it's a great idea. I'll look into that. Thanks for the tip. :)
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Count me in. I have always wanted to try intarsia, but have been too chicken.
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Hi Bukshy - ask any question and someo0ne will respond. Jump on in.
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I think I am going to try segmentation first, before I give intarsia a try. 8)
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The lighthouse looks way nice there. I will have to download some cartoon pages and try for my grand kids.
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http://www.sg-patterns.com/free-stained-glass-patterns.html
that site has like 30 or 40 pages of stained glass patterns...some very easy for segmentation...i think i got the lighthouse on that one....
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The lighthouse looks great. I neglected to write the the other night in my hurry to look for stained glass patterns, lol.
I got my book in the mail today. I already know the project I want to make from it but I will do some of the earlier ones first to sort of work my way up to it. Thanks for suggesting it, Dan.
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Never thought about stained glass patterns. Great idea. 8)
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You are quite welcome. Dan
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OK, here's a question for you more experienced folks.
I made the bear door topper pattern (segmentation) from the current issue of Creative Woodworking and Crafts. If you don't know the pattern, that isn't particularly important. The question works for any pattern - or so I assume.
When I had it all painted and glued to the backing, I sprayed it with Krylon for protection. I spray in the garage with the door cracked to let out the fumes. While I haven't ever had a leaf blow in and attach itself to my current project, it is far from a sterile environment.
What I noticed with the bear was that the areas where the segments come together gets horribly rough and grainy-feeling. I sanded but wasn't sure how hard would be safe and it was pretty hard to get in there without oversanding the other areas. So I am not satisfied with the final finish.
Now I have cut and am in the process of sanding the pieces for another project. My question is should I spray them before gluing them to the backer board? The gluing side would be down so it should be safe from the spray. I am leaning toward doing that but I thought I'd go ahead and ask. What's the way you guys usually do this?
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Becky, I think what you are describing is the grain raising from using water based paints. To help eliminate this you need to raise the grain before you paint. Dampen the wood with a damp sponge. Let dry, then sand off the raised fibers.Then paint.
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You can also try using a sanding sealer, that will raise the grain, sand it back and then paint, also stops the wood absorbing too much paint and improves the finish, still a good idea to spray before gluing the peices to the backer though.
Ian
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Thanks. It could well have been the paint. I thinned it down quite a bit so there was as much if not more water than paint.
I'll do as you advise. I think I'll try the damp sponge this time. It's cheaper and doesn't require a trip to the store. And I will spray before assembly.
Thanks! I *do* love this site. You guys really save me a lot of grief!
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:D hello friends! ... ;)
To avoid this problem, I built a small cabinet with painting.
It is a cubic box open on one side. On top I placed a fan with a hose leads outside. On the outside I put a windbreaker to avoid the chimney effect.
At the base, I put a turntable driven by a small electric motor and a small multiplier speed from an electric oven (rotisserie), they are isolated from the cabinet.
From there, simply place the object to paint or varnish on the shelf, turn the tray, turn the fan (in the sense aspiration) and paint without the odor in the room. This does not obviate the need a mask anyway. ;)
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So I played mad scientist tonight, lol. I dampened some scrap of the same material and sanded off the fibers. I must say, it felt exactly like my prior project did so I think you definitely nailed the cause.
Then I did a little painting with my well-diluted acrylics. I noticed two things. One is that new fibers seemed to rise up and it got rough again. Ack! But it was just scrap so after it dried I took some 400 grit sand paper and sanded them back down. It didn't mess with the colors for the most part.
Would using the sanding sealer eliminate the re-rising of the fibers or is that something you just have to deal with? I would definitely invest in some if it totally eliminates the problem. Or did I just not wet it enough the first time? You said damp so I didn't soak it. After the wetting/drying I only sanded enough to make it smooth again. I don't think I overdid it, potentially exposing previously undampened fibers though I suppose that is possible.
Sorry if I am asking too many questions. I'm just really happy with how the cutting of this project went (not something I can say every time!) and I don't want to screw it up now.
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Becky, I'm not a painter but my wife used to do decorative or tole painting. Her painting advise is:
Raise grain with damp sponge. Let dry.
Sand raised fibers.
paint, let dry.
Sand again.
Apply second coat of paint.
Good luck!
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Becky, Check this guys video out he may be able to help you, the link is to the video on dealing with raised grain, he has others, the one before it tells you why the wood grain raises. Hope this helps.
http://www.ehow.com/video_4427240_smoothing-raised-wood-grain.html
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For those looking for some videos on Intarsia here's one that will get you started. The 2nd video from the top showing the Rose isn't all that instructive but afterwards it lists several others that should be of interest.
http://www.google.com/search?q=wood+intarsia+video&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=7Rq&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=v&source=univ&tbs=vid:1&tbo=u&ei=_pYSTN3WFKLuMNmqyOMI&sa=X&oi=video_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4&ved=0CCgQqwQwAw
Pete
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;) Thank you for the videos guys ;)
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Here's what all the fuss was about if you're interested.
I ended up buying a can of the sanding sealer. It did keep the grain down but it was hard to paint on. It was almost like trying to get the paint to balance in the right spot until it dried. Well, it is a sealer so I guess it sealed! I did find that if I started with a coat of less thinned paint as a base, my washes did better on top of that. Experimentation and all, I am pretty happy with it and it is definitely nice and smooth. :)
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Wow Becky that is so cool! You did a wonderful job!
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Thanks, dgman. The patten was in that Creative Scrollsaw Segmentation book recommened earlier in this thread. I didn't follow their painting of it but went online to find a pic of the actual painting and did my best to imitate it.
I cut a Van Gogh yesterday but I'll probably be all week sanding it. Lots of little pointy protrusions on most of the pieces so I will have to be slow and careful with those.
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Great Job Becky. Cheers.
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Nice job Becky, looks great. I like the colors.
8) 8) 8)
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That looks really nice Becky, you done a good job of that.
I've never had a problem getting the paint to stick to sanding sealer but then i like bright colors and do tend to put the paint on without thinning it too much.
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I enjoy doing intarsia
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Thanks, folks. I had a brainstorm and have been using my sanding mop on the pieces of my Van Gogh. It takes a long time (and a few search and rescue missions) but is easier on the bumps and protrusions I have in this new one. Maybe a coarser grit would be better.
I have a Dremel and used the sanding drum attachment things on much of The Scream but also sanded away a significant section of my thumbnail and underlying skin. What do you intarsia and segmentation folks do for sanding? It seems like there has to be a better way, especially for the small and/or delicate pieces.
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Every time I did a small segmentation project which contained small pieces, I would wind up with no finger nails left from sanding the small pieces with the Dremel. They would also sometimes catch on the sanding drum and go flying across the room, leaving me to searching for them on my hands and knees for who knows how long.
Just recently, my partner started doing segmentations. He took a scrap piece of wood and some double sided tape and stuck the small piece to the little block of wood. He was then able to use the Dremel to his hearts (and finger's) content. I was sitting here thinking to myself - "why didn't I think of that"?
I have recent segmentation projects with small pieces and tried this out and it works perfectly. You need to change the tape after each piece you sand, naturally because the dust, but it is easier than grinding your fingers down and looking for small pieces. :)
Sheila
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When I have done some smaller pieces, I have used the rubber finger tips available at office supply stores. JGR is also selling some at her site - www.intarsia.com. I have not tried those though.
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Ah, Sheila! Great idea! Thank you! Is the double-sided tape you refer to just the double sided Scotch tape you can get at the grocery story or is it something more exotic? I've double sided tape mentioned a lot of times but never knew if the plain stuff in the kitchen drawer would work.
I got an e-mail from Woodcraft saying they have 20-piece sets of the diamond tipped burrs on sale for $5.99. I am thinking of getting a set of those too for places the small sanding drum won't fit.
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Becky, it is the carpet type of double sided tape. I think the 3M is good, but it is really, really strong. I find that using the strong tape can be better because it really holds the pieces into place. However, I also use it to do stack cutting and I am quite careful to put little squares in the WASTE areas mostly, with maybe a corner going on the piece. For the intarsia though, I definitely prefer it. If you find it is too strong, use a small paring type knife to gently pry the piece off when done. After sanding tiny parts until my fingers literally bled, it was one of those "duh" moments to try to use this. I also use craft sticks (popsicle sticks) for some small pieces like hummingbird feathers. :)
Sheila
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I don't have a camera so I can't take a picture, but I made a small parts holder. It's a handle I turned on the lathe, with a very small wood screw on the end. I drill a small hole on the back of the small intarsia piece, screw it onto the the tool and sand away!
Maybe I will get my son to take a picture with his camera so I can post it here.
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I've never done Intarsia (yet) but to hold small pieces or parts i use tweezers similar to these shown at Amazon....
http://www.amazon.com/Grobet-57-760-Resistant-Fiber-Tweezer/dp/B0015T22XI/ref=sr_1_6?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1276823014&sr=1-6 (http://www.amazon.com/Grobet-57-760-Resistant-Fiber-Tweezer/dp/B0015T22XI/ref=sr_1_6?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1276823014&sr=1-6)
They are what I call "Normally Closed" so they hold the part without you having to squeeze the handles.
~~~GrayBeard~~~
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Ahhhh... I see the final product but have absolutely no idea how you do it.
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Thanks again, Sheila. The tape sounds like the easiest solution (not having to drill holes or wait for a delivery). I'll hit the Home Depot or Lowes and see what they have. It seems better to have a tape that is hard to get loose from than one that will let the part wiggle around when I am trying to work on it. I am already thinking to make the tape a little long and then pry - if needed - off the scrap leaving myself a tab to pull on to remove it from the piece being sanded.
If I don't like the tape I have these other ideas to fall back on too, so thanks to all of you for responding. My learning curve is so reduced thanks to all of you.
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Let us know, Becky. I just started doing this a couple of months ago and I would like to know if you like it as much as me. The other ideas are good too so there are always choices. :) It is good to know what to tell people.
Sheila
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Will do. :) I did run to the Home Depot today. The didn't have the 3M brand but they had some from Gorilla so I bought that.
I'm getting a real kick out of doing the art reproductions so I might just cut another one tomorrow and/or Sunday. The one I will probably do has a number of little pieces so they will be a good test.
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OK, I lied. ;) Apparently I don't know my large African animals. The brand I bought was Rhino, not Gorilla. Sorry about that.
That stuff was a bust. It wasn't an actual tape but a sort of glue film. Long story short, it was just way to hard to try to work with. Went to another store, got Scotch brand which is at least made by 3M. :) That worked a LOT better.
I had some very tiny pieces that it didn't hold very well but they were only about 1/2" long by 1/8" wide. I don't think they had enough surface area to stick to anything when attacked with a Dremel tool. Even so, just bracing them on the scrap with a little stickiness was better than nothing. I didn't clobber my nails/flesh.
Larger pieces (dime to penny size) stuck pretty solidly though and I was able to get them up without undue problem. I didn't have a lot of time to play with it as I had Father's Day at dinner tonight. Tomorrow I will try long, thin pieces with sort of odd shapes. It looks very promising from what I've seen so far.
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Becky - one of the items learned at JGR's class is to use the double stick tape like you are using, but then you also double stick the side of the piece to an adjacent piece and sand them together. This helps stabilize the smaller pieces. Make sure that you get the thin double stick carpet tape. The thicker tape is extremely hard to remove. You might also try using the finger protectors mentioned in one of the earlier messages. My finger nails sometimes have these "funny" flat areas on them. Hmmm, wonder where that is from.
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I believe that 'fingernail' malady you refer to is called "Scroller's Manicure"!
And I have the funny shaped nails to prove it!
~~~GrayBeard~~~