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General Category => General Scroll Saw Talk => Topic started by: jimbo on September 09, 2010, 11:26:27 pm
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At the scroll saw work shop I attended a few weeks ago I was asked by the instructor why I was cutting at such a high speed [just under half], he turned the speed rite down and said try that, and I have been cutting at a low speed ever since, I have only broken 1 blade and they are lasting a lot longer, in fact I have worn the teeth off 3 blades on hard wood and no breakages, so I was wondering why they have speeds up to 1600 SPM on saws??? I have found I have more control at a lower speed and just as fast
Jimbo
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Jimbo, I very rarely cut at full speed, however I do not saw at a set speed. I set the speed according to "feel". I will set the speed Depending on the type and thickness of wood and type and size of blade. If I feel I'm cutting to slow I will increase the speed. If I feel I can't control the cut I will slow it down, all by feel.
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I pretty much am in line with dgman. I will vary the speed depending upon the wood, blade type, and the pattern. It really is a feel thing and the more you cut, the better the feel.
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Me too!
I have been doing this for about two years now and I am finally "getting the feel" for it.
Just keep experimenting as you go along and it will begin to come.
Wood + Blade + Saw Speed = "The Feel"
AND "The Feel" for me will likely be different than for you.
The ONE thing I have to keep reminding myself...."Let the BLADE do the work"!
~~~GrayBeard~~~
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I usually cut at full speed. With the right blade and as long as I am not cutting just one layer of 1/8-1/4" wood I can stay on the line with out trouble. The only time I slow my saw down is when cutting the one layer of thin stuff or cutting corian. I guess I have a feel for the wood and blade and know when to stop and go. It all comes with time, and that is what is the greatest teacher.
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I'm always at full speed. I don't even know where the speed control is on old yeller. Maybe I should try this.
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I am with the group that cuts according to 'feel'. Usually it is somewhere in the middle of the dial. I try to cut fast enough to not have the wood chattering (as I use mostly reverse tooth blades) but slow enough to keep on the line. I don't like cutting too fast. Maybe it is the type of things I cut. I find that it is far more relaxing for me going at a medium speed. The speed of the blade doesn't necessarily coincide with how fast you cut things out. I think I cut fast enough, but it isn't a race for me. I like being relaxed and having fun and to me it is more fun to 'split the line' and really be accurate.
Sheila :)
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I "feel" for the right speed to.
I experienced that the higher the speed (short turns in thicker wood) the greater the risk at burning the wood.
also in fine work I keep better on track at low speed.
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I cut at full speed. I think I just might try and slow it down on thin wood. Good suggestion. 8)
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Since I use nothing but spirals, i judge speed by thickness and hardness of the wood. Harder or thicker wood = faster speed, thin or softer wood = slower for more control. I am with Sheila I like to relax when I cut.
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I adjust my speed control often. Sometimes it feels right to slow down others to speed up.
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I am a full speed cutter but have just recently started to adjust the speed control down some. I am going to play with this more as I have been breaking blades like crazy.
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I think I get a cleaner cut at a lower speed and also eliminate burning and if a mistake is made it is only a small one, also getting back on line is easier, as with wood turning a higher speed gives a cleaner cut, BUT a mistake such as a dig in is BIG and repairs can take some time to do
Jimbo
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I also tend to cut with a slower speed. It's trial and error, and once you find the right combination, where the wood doesn't jump, and doesn't burn, and you can stay on the line, you have the ideal speed for you. For me, if I turn the speed up, the blades seem to dull faster and turning and following the line is more difficult.
Mark
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Over the weekend, I slowed the speed up and it worked like a charm. Thanks guys... and gals! :)
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I'm a speed by feel cutter too. I really have never had ol yeller above 6 I don't think. It just makes the blade too hot and brittle. I also do mostly fretwork or puzzles and sharp turns don't like high speed. Not for me any way.
Janet glad you found the speed control.
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I have tried to slow it down but it takes some getting use to. I am so use to running at full speed. 8)
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I found this chart useful when i first started cutting
Blade Size-Speed Chart:
# 2/0 800-1100 Speed
This blade is good for very fine detail in corners and tight curves because smaller blades will turn tighter radius cuts. Faster than 1200 will usually shorten blade life from the heat buildup causin premature breakage. Will have some fine tear out on the bottom of the work piece.
1/8" Baltic Plywood and hardwoods
1/4" Baltic Plywood and hardwoods
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# 2/0R 800-1200
This blade is used the same as the 2/0 but will eliminate the bottom tear out. When cutting less than 1/4" thick material, check that the reverse teeth are not cutting through the top of piece , leaving tear out on the top instead of the bottom. The bottom of the blade can be trimmed off to lower blade in the clamps to fix this problem, just don't lower it to where the reverse teeth do not contact the wood.
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# 2 800-1200 Speed
This blade will not cut as tight of radius as the 2/0, so not as much fine detail can be done with this blade. It has a longer blade life than the 2/0.
3/8" Baltic Plywood 3/8" Hardwoods
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#2R 800-1200 Speed
Will do the same as the 2, but with the reverse teeth the bottom tear out is eliminated.
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#5R 1000-1850 Speed
This is my favorite blade. Because of the reverse tooth there is not any bottom tear out. It will cut fast and leaves a good smooth surface ready to paint. Over 1850 speed the heat build up reduces blade life considerably.
1/8" (6 layers stacked) Baltic Plywood
1/4" ( 3 layers stacked) Baltic Plywood
3/4" (2 layers 1/2") (3 layers 1/4") Pine
1/4" to 3/4" Hardwoods ( Test cut all hardwoods because some, due to density, will leave a burn mark on the cut edge, due to the reverse tooth design of the blade)
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#5 1000-1850 Speed
When the cut edge is burned, switch to this blade to eliminate the burning. There will be bottom tear out with this blade that will need to be sanded after cutting. Will cut faster than the reverse tooth blades , so on some of the 3/4" pine it may be better to cut simple designs with this blade for speed ( sanding on a stationary belt sander after cutting).
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#9R 1200-2000 Speed
Good for cutting thicker materials. Does not have the tight turning radius of the smaller size blades.
1 1/2" Pine
Thicker hardwoods
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#9 1200-2000 Speed
Use when edge burning occurs as described for the #5 blades.
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# 12R 1400-2000 Speed
A good cutoff blade. Will cut about as fast as the bandsaw. Good for cutting off lumber and plywood's to the desired shapes and sizes. Can cut some of the 1 1/2 pine but the edges will not be as smooth as when using the smaller blades.
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This chart is given as a good starting reference point. You may want to try some of the other brands and types of blades available but this should get you started in the area of what each blade is used for.
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thanks for sharing.
..... my saw starts at 400.... don't see that in the list
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I did not know that saws got up to 2000spm, and I have as yet not seen one that has a speed indicator, and at that speed I would think it would be uncontrollable let alone the burning from the blade, what do you all think????
Jimbo
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I think you're right Jimbo, 2000 looks quit fast.
my Hegner goes about 1400 rpm and I don't use that speed very often.
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My saw speed runs from 400-1550 SPM. Cannot imagine 2000 SPM. Wow. Nice find there tinker1. It will give the newbies a good reference. I use exclusively Flying Dutchman Blades. 8)
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My saw is a delta q3, it has a speed indicator dial and can be adjusted to run from 300spm-2000spm.
I usually run it on average between 700-900spm for most projects i do.
speed depends on how intricate the pattern is and what type of wood (material) im cutting so not to burn it.
I've also cut copper,plastic, aluminum, and brass with it using jeweler's blades
I also use a foot control (power on-off)
I believe the speeds listed in the chart are to show at what the blades can be ran at (top speed).
(Basically find the speed your most comfortable with for your project.)
My first saw was a sears single speed,(didn't take long for me to figure out its limitations when it came to intricate pattern cutting)
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I always slow the saw down per feel and type of material. If you cut acrylic at a high speed it will just melt the blade thru the plastic and refuse on the back sid of the blade. Also less vibration at slower speeds so you feel more refreshe when you have been cutting a long time.
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A SPM speed indicator would be great as you could adjust back to the speed most comfortable for the wood being cut, was this a separate attachment or did come with the saw?, some vari. speed lathes have an indicator
Jimbo
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A SPM speed indicator would be great as you could adjust back to the speed most comfortable for the wood being cut, was this a separate attachment or did come with the saw?, some vari. speed lathes have an indicator
Jimbo
My saw came with variable speed dial, here is a add-on speed dial.
I've never used a add-on myself, maybe someone else will have some more information on them.
*(They state that you'll need to make sure its compatible with your motor)
http://cgi.ebay.com/SCROLL-SAW-MOTOR-VARIABLE-SPEED-CONTROL-TOOL-NEW-/180495999768?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a06666318
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I have a Dewalt and I have never cut at full speed. I only turned it that high to check for vibration, I was curious how it would do at that speed, and it did well. For a beginner I always recommend they start slow to get their control down. You can speed up as you progress and get the "feel" of your machine. So many woods will burn if you cut them at a high speed, particularly cherry and oak.
I also adjust as I am cutting. On a straight part I will speed up the machine and slow down around fretwork.
Barry
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I am with the group that feel for the right speed. I also agree with Sheila, it's the fun that counts and not how fast you cut something, coming to think of it I hardly go above medium speed. Nice thread with some intresting reading.
David
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be carefull when using add-on speed control.
some use the same technique as light dimmer and don't use electronic "phase shift" which is absolute necessary having an induction motor on your saw.
speed control on induction motors is expencive and can give problems.
that's why Proxon whent from variable speed control to a 2 speed.
if you have the wrong add-on speed control you destroy your motor!
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Nice to know Marcel, I have the proxxon with viarable speed control, it has been going for 2 years now. The activity centre I go to has 2 new proxxons, now I know why it only has 2 speed settings, fast and very fast. Am saving for a hegner(might have one in about 100 years time :P)
David
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Checked the specs on my EX21 - it maxes out at 1550. I do use high speed when cutting something out of 2X stock without a lot of detail.
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Jimbo. Slow for me. I guess I'm use to cutting on slow. And I'm not in any hurry anyway. Dave
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Hey Julie I find with my 21 EX I get a bit of rumbling at high speed how is yours? [not that I would use it at that speed now] also Blakie contacted me and said his mate had an electrical prob, with his and it turns out they have a fuse and not a cut out switch
Jimbo
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The only time mine gets to "rumbling" is when I'm pushing a 2 X 12 through it. It still has less vibration than any other machine in its class. I do so much with thick lumber - it is a little odd for me to do tiny projects. I am working on a lot smaller stuff right now - ornaments, jewelry boxes and the like - I have a display going into a salon for consignment. Thin wood feels a little weird to me. It is a lot easier.
There is a circuit board in the back under the black strip that runs down the center of the back of the saw. It has a lifetime warranty, so they should send him whatever he needs. I had a problem with my speed control a while back and after trouble shooting it over the phone - they sent me everything it might be - speed control, circuit board and even a new motor. (at that point I was cutting everything at full speed because it wouldn't go any slower). They are a great company to do business with.
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Thanks for the info Julie
Jimbo